Ok, one of my students just asked me this...

The life of John Keats the man: his family, his friends, and his contemporaries.

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Ok, one of my students just asked me this...

Postby dks » Wed Feb 28, 2007 4:06 pm

"Who would win in a fight? Keats? Or Byron?"

8) Obviously, my students don't know our man, do they? It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog, eh?
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Postby Malia » Wed Feb 28, 2007 5:14 pm

Duh, hello, it Byron would beat him! :roll: :lol:
Oh, you mean if they faught while Keats was not coughing up a lung? Well, then Keats would whip that uppity uppercrust's snotty nose all the way to Loch Lomond!
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Postby dks » Wed Feb 28, 2007 9:45 pm

Yeah...Keats would kick his ass...truly. He was scrappy and smart--our man would've gone right for the club foot... :wink:
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Postby Saturn » Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:11 pm

I never noticed this thread before but I have to disagree.

Keats may have been able to beat a butcher boy in a street brawl but Byron was an avid sportsman, very strong, and used to box in his spare time, taking lessons form the foremost boxer of the period "Gentleman" Jackson - Keats wouldn't have stood a chance [unless he punched him in the nuts or something :lol: ].
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Postby Malia » Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:50 pm

Saturn wrote:I never noticed this thread before but I have to disagree.

Keats may have been able to beat a butcher boy in a street brawl but Byron was an avid sportsman, very strong, and used to box in his spare time, taking lessons form the foremost boxer of the period "Gentleman" Jackson - Keats wouldn't have stood a chance [unless he punched him in the nuts or something :lol: ].



Oooh. . .them's fightin' words, man! Put 'em up! My Poet can beat up your poet! :lol: (Yes, I'm hillarious, aren't I? ;) ) I think, though, that Keats *would* have a chance. He was small and spry and could certainly duck when necessary! :lol: I think that just because Keats was small and not professionally trained to fight doesn't mean he couldn't kick someone's (even Byron's) butt. We know that Keats was into sports and played them well. I guess I just have an anti-Byron prejudice. I know, I know, it isn't fair to ol Byron, but. . .
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Postby Credo Buffa » Wed Mar 28, 2007 12:28 am

Byron did have that bum leg, didn't he? Keats could just run circles around him until Byron became too worn down trying to follow him, and then Keats could just push him over. :wink:
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Postby Malia » Wed Mar 28, 2007 12:31 am

Credo Buffa wrote:Byron did have that bum leg, didn't he? Keats could just run circles around him until Byron became too worn down trying to follow him, and then Keats could just push him over. :wink:



:lol:

Yeah, didn't Byron have a club foot or something?
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Postby Saturn » Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:35 am

This thread :lol: :lol: :lol:

Byron's club foot is one of those great misconceptions that people trot out who nothing about Byron but the sensationalist claims of others.

He played on the legend a bit himself to make himself out as deformed but in fact it was that one of his legs was slightly twisted and longer than the other.

He did have a pronounced limp [sometimes used for effect rather] but this did not in any way impair his sporting ability and of course he was an excellent swimmer also and famously swam across the Bosphorus [from Sestos to Abydos] which is no mean feat today and for an fully able bodied swimmer.

It's a stupid question anyway but you guys know so little and are so unjustly prejudiced against Byron I'd thought I'd enlighten you all a little.
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Postby Credo Buffa » Wed Mar 28, 2007 12:26 pm

Hey, I resent that comment of ignorance, Saturn! I got that bum leg/limp info from my Romantic lit prof (who was totally brilliant, by the way). Besides, having a slight handicap doesn't affect most people's ability to swim (and I can attest to that personally). :roll: :P

Anyway, say that Byron's limp was mostly for show. He could hardly give up on it just for a fight with Keats, could he? It'd be like putting on an accent, because you can't just get rid of it randomly one day without expecting someone to notice. So Byron decides that he'd rather forego his limp for a few minutes than get beat up by a shorter guy, but soon word gets out that not only did Byron lose the fight anyway (tee hee), but he appeared to have full use of his supposedly bad leg in the process. "Well good grief, Byron's such a faker! He's just desperate for attention. Let's ignore him and go play with the other poets."

:P
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Postby Saturn » Wed Mar 28, 2007 12:36 pm

Did I say ignorance?

Even professors can be wrong too you know :wink:

Byron's limp is not a wholly cleared up mystery. Even when they opened his tomb in the 1880's [I think] they were still not even sure which leg it actually was because of conflicting reports in his time.

This is such a stupid thing to argue about anyway it's like "who win in a fight between Batman and Spiderman?" - I've grown out of such stupid playground arguments :roll:

The picture of Byron and Keats going at it in the ring though does make me laugh.

It should be a Monty Python sketch :lol:
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Postby Credo Buffa » Wed Mar 28, 2007 12:39 pm

Saturn wrote:It should be a Monty Python sketch :lol:

Sort of like the football match between the Greek and German philosophers. :lol:
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Postby Saturn » Wed Mar 28, 2007 12:43 pm

Or like one I was watching the other day which was a spoof religious affairs programme where a Cardinal took on an Atheist professor in the Wrestling ring :lol:
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Re: Ok, one of my students just asked me this...

Postby SnuggleKeats » Sun Oct 12, 2008 9:06 pm

I've gotta agree with Saturn that some people are being juuuuust a bit harsh about Byron. I'm not starting drama and I don't even care all that much because I think making fun of him is hilarious. And, really, the guy - despite being an arrogant prick at most times - was pretty awesome. I found these two details the other day and just about fell off my chair laughing:

"...he scoffed at the school rule forbidding the keeping of dogs by keeping a tamed bear in the turret above his quarters."

WIN.

Also:

Byron fell in love with the young Countess Teresa Guiccioli in Italy. He became involved in the Italian nationalism movement through her father and brother. Eventually Teresa's husband, who had allowed her affairs with Byron, applied for a separation. Shelley visited the couple in 1821 and commented on Byron's unusual lifestyle in a letter to a friend:


Lord Byron gets up at two. I get up, quite contrary to my usual custom . . . at 12. After breakfast we sit talking till six. From six to eight we gallop through the pine forest which divide Ravenna from the sea; we then come home and dine, and sit up gossiping till six in the morning. I don't suppose this will kill me in a week or fortnight, but I shall not try it longer. Lord B.'s establishment consists, besides servants, of ten horses, eight enormous dogs, three monkeys, five cats, an eagle, a crow, and a falcon; and all these, except the horses, walk about the house, which every now and then resounds with their unarbitrated quarrels, as if they were the masters of it. . . . [P.S.] I find that my enumeration of the animals in this Circean Palace was defective . . . . I have just met on the grand staircase five peacocks, two guinea hens, and an Egyptian crane. I wonder who all these animals were before they were changed into these shapes.


In a fight, I think Keats would win simply out of determination, proving that one can be under six feet tall and not a lord and still win a fight. That is, until Byron sends the bear after him. :lol:

It IS great fun to pick on Byron, especially in defense of Keats as we all know Byron did his fair share of making fun. But at least he retracted the statements after Keats' death, which is more than one would consider him capable of. And also, Keats, according to the Gittings biography, did look up to him for a time as the ideal image of a poet and admired him greatly.

Plus, let's face it...The guy was hot. Call me immature, but I can't help it. Don't get me wrong, Keats is my number one, and I kicked my boyfriend in the ribs last night for making a bad comment about him. But the only reason I'd kick Lord Byron out of bed is so that we could continue the naughty-making on the floor. :)

Also, please tell me I'm not the only one who'd KILL to be a fly with a video camera on the wall for Byron and Shelley's 'gossiping' sessions...
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Re: Ok, one of my students just asked me this...

Postby Saturn » Sun Oct 12, 2008 10:24 pm

Lol I think Byron would have kicked you out of bed if you didn't look like a 15 year old by which was ultimately his ideal sexual preference. I don't think most people realise but many of those most famous of his love poems were written to a choirboy at Harrow, John Edleston.

I think if he were alive today and didn't need to conform to those old-fashioned moralities he would be-out-and-out-gay, I think he only really indulged in heterosexual relationships to quell suspicions of his peers [most of whom, or the closest of whom knew exactly what his true preferences were]. His happiest times were in an all male environment, in Harrow, at Cambridge, in Greece etc.

He had no real affection for women, even his supposed greatest female attachments were to women whom he considered equals like Lady Melbourne, and not his female sexual partners. I think he was a man who loved sex, so he was bisexual for that reason, but in affections it was always to adolescent boys that he felt most intensely the emotion of love.

Sorry that was totally off-topic but I had to get that off my chest...

Yes I'd love a video camera in the room, at the House on Lake Geneva in 1816 with Byron, Shelly, Polidori and Mary reading their ghost stories in the midst of that dark winter, out of which came two of the greatest literary characters of the last century; Frankenstein and The Vampyre [Polidori's short story which began the vampire myth in English fiction which ultimately resulted in Stoker's Dracula].
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Re: Ok, one of my students just asked me this...

Postby Malia » Sun Oct 12, 2008 10:55 pm

Is it true (or highly accepted by professionals, at least) that Byron was most likely bi-polar and suffered a great deal from that illness? I read somewhere that his tendency to go on sexual binges was one way he acted out his manic episodes. Anyone ever heard of this or did I just make it up and not realize it?
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