WHOAH!

The life of John Keats the man: his family, his friends, and his contemporaries.

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WHOAH!

Postby Matt » Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:38 pm

I've only been away three weeks and already you're all arguing!

This is how I see it:
Stephen Crummey-the biggest poster on here- was unfairly criticised by Junkets-the newcome(hi by the way). This angered me but my anger was dissolved when I reminded myself that Junkets is new to this forum and has no understanding whatsoever of the relationships and types of people on this forum. If he did he'd know that Stephen is the Don. And not just the Don but a nice bloke too. Also, I must commend NewAustria for jumping to Stephen's defence. I'm a big fan of loyalty.

Then, I saw in another post Stephen post a fairly legitimate
comment to which Despondence replied 'you been burned by a woman or something....dont try and argue...you'll lose' This suprised me, as I've said before I am a fan of loyalty and Despondence seemed to act too quickly in criticising Stephen.

Now...do we all make friends? Or do we create alliances? Ha Ha. I like the first option. All the old boys (including me!) should fill Junkets in on how things are here and we can welcome him in. If not.....who knows? I know what I'm a gonna do
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Postby Saturn » Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:49 pm

Thanks for the words Matt - I was new on here once remember - so were you.

Junkets seems to be very intelligent and would be a very worthy contributer - he could even replace me as I feel I really have very little more to say about Keats, poetry, art and literature.

All it needs is for him to be a little less hostile and confrontational - it's only poetry - it isn't worth it!!!

I have spent too long already wasting my life on these things while experience has passed me by - the best years of my life are already gone forever.

In fact I had a warped view of the world, of love and life which my obsession (and it used to be a total obsession) with poetry only fuelled by cosetting me from life and giving me false hopes and false dreams - these, have now fallen to ashes at my feet and I can no longer trust or believe that poesy will do me any good in the harsh world we all have to face, so I may as well bid it a fair adieu while I am still young enough to try and rebuild my life on a more realistic premiss.
"Oh what a misery it is to have an intellect in splints".
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Postby Junkets » Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:17 am

Having discovered this forum only a few days ago I thought it may provide a welcome distraction from the woes of work and an opportunity to discuss Keats (a past time that has proved virtually fruitless outside of academia). Having waffled on a few threads I was welcomed to the forum by Stephen with "who cares" and "do you think Keats would give a damn", which was...um...well...a little more than blunt. It is quite clear that I have entered this forum completely blind to the personalities and politics it already contains and was not expecting such a curt rebuttal. I don't think I have got off to the best start in this forum and shall endeavour to continue in a more convivial fashion.

So back to the man himself...
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Postby Saturn » Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:21 am

Apologies for my rudeness and abruptness - I'm having a really hard time at the minute.

Please feel free to contribute as much as possible to this forum - I have nothing left to say.
"Oh what a misery it is to have an intellect in splints".
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Postby Junkets » Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:57 am

Nothing left to say? On the subject of Keats, or in general? Surely it can't all be that bad?
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Postby Despondence » Thu Oct 14, 2004 11:29 am

Matt: I jumped in because Stephen was talking out of his ass and making an idiot of himself. I must have missed the part where "Stephen was unfairly criticized by Junkets", but in the thread in question, Stephen's lashing out was completely unmotivated and very tactless.

Now, if it had been anybody else, I couldn't have cared less. I don't feed the trolls, on general principles. But this was Stephen C, whom I've come to respect greatly, and thought I knew. So I told him to back off and cool down, and think again. I thought I was doing him a favor by giving it to him straight. Maybe I was wrong. If so, I owe him an apology.
Despondence
 

Postby Saturn » Thu Oct 14, 2004 11:47 am

I didn't "lash out" at anybody, just stated an obvious fact : Keats is dead - he can't feel anything whatsoever and certainly, if he could, wouldn't give a damn what was written on his tombstone - his work is what is important - that is his greatest and most fitting memorial.

I thought I was pathetic when I used to get wound up by such things!!!!!!!!!
"Oh what a misery it is to have an intellect in splints".
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Postby Saturn » Thu Oct 14, 2004 11:55 am

It is that bad............

I don't understand why Despondence seems to feel I have betrayed myself, or acted differently than normal.

I just have become tired of people taking all this too seriously - in the end it's only words, poetry is just an escapist fantasy that I for one was seriously misled by - I'm too old and realistic to think anybody gives a toss about what someone dead for 183 years had to say.
"Oh what a misery it is to have an intellect in splints".
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Postby Despondence » Thu Oct 14, 2004 12:22 pm

You're not making a lot of sense, Stephen. Didn't lash out? Stated an obvious fact? Yes, thank you for telling us Keats is dead and that he doesn't care anymore, I was always a little confused on that point.
Suit yourself. I offered you a hint, but I can't be bothered to shove it into your skull.
Despondence
 

Postby Saturn » Thu Oct 14, 2004 12:31 pm

Maybe you should make yourself clearer - I'm obviously too thick and stupid to get at what you are hinting at.

I don't know what's happening to everyone on here - one newbie comes on and upsets the whole applecart, throws a cat among the pigeons, etc, etc.

Why is everyone at everyone else's necks at the moment?? - I certainly hold nothing against anyone at all - I'm not combative by nature, except when sticking up for myself when I feel I have not done anything wrong, as in this case.
"Oh what a misery it is to have an intellect in splints".
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Postby Junkets » Thu Oct 14, 2004 1:07 pm

An escapist fantasy? Oh no no no! Endymion, arguably, erred towards the escapist and fantastical, but with the later poems Keats had his feet firmly on the ground and was deeply entrenched in that which is realistic and earthly. Even poetry such as Spencer's The Faerie Queen can easily be thought of as fantasy, when it is in actuality an allegorical address of reality, the history of ancient Britain.
You seem to be disillusioned by poetry, Stephen, and, dare I say it, embittered for some reason. I for one give a toss about what this 183 years dead man, and other dead men and women have said, and I don't think I'm taking it too seriously. After all, without the words of these dead people how can we build a "vision of the Eternal Now' in which past and future are consumed'. And besides those who forget the past are condemed to repeat it.
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Postby Junkets » Thu Oct 14, 2004 1:08 pm

Oh dear, I have cause a bit of trouble, haven't I.
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Postby Saturn » Thu Oct 14, 2004 1:10 pm

I'm just disillusioned generally - not just poetry - maybe it's beacause I suffer from depression - things are just getting on top of me at the moment - I don't know if I'll ever recover the massive enthusiasm I once had for poesy.
"Oh what a misery it is to have an intellect in splints".
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Postby Saturn » Thu Oct 14, 2004 1:15 pm

Don't blame yourself at all - everything youv'e written sounds like what I used to write - read my much earlier posts and you'll see what I mean - I was exctly the same as you once, but life has given me a big slap in the face that's made me lose what faith I had in words and poems.

Blame me, if anyone - I just can't get up for any of these debates anymore.

Apologies to Junkets, Matt, Despondence, all the regulars - I'm just not on form anymore.
"Oh what a misery it is to have an intellect in splints".
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Postby Despondence » Thu Oct 14, 2004 2:03 pm

Oh come off it, Stephen. A slap in the face? What are you, made of glass? The cosmos continuously conspires against all of us - you should know that by now. It's nothing personal. Now.

You asked me to be clearer. Well ok. In two threads you came down in a most condescending manner on a newbie who, in my books, have done nothing wrong. In both cases, Junkets' posts were entirely reasonable and polite, until you decided to take his head off. You can't burst in on a discussion, make inflammatory statements like "who cares", "do you think Keats gives a damn", "get over it" etc, call people ignorant, and expect everybody to bow down to your wisdom. Who you are and your history on the forum is at that point irrelevant.

I disagree with thenewaustria and Matt, laying the blame on Junkets for this. You started it, the posts are there for everybody to go back and check, and Junkets responded with more grace than you deserved.

Now, it looks as if your very latest posts in the current thread confirmes what I was trying to tell you in the first place. You are not yourself, for personal reasons that are none of our business, but it affects your judgement. And manners, for that matter. Since you and Junkets have sorted things out between the two of you, I think that should be the end of the story. These things happen, no one holds a grudge.
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