Were the letters TO Keats ever published???

The life of John Keats the man: his family, his friends, and his contemporaries.

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Re: Were the letters TO Keats ever published???

Postby laraffinee » Thu Aug 19, 2010 5:08 am

Raphael - I did read the responses in this tread and do not find my questions answered. Yes - I know the letters were destroyed or buried with him- I wonder if it is know exactly why - perhaps in some conversation or letter to Brown or Severn? I did not state that I think Fanny Browne was flippant - rather that some have portrayed her as such.
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Re: Were the letters TO Keats ever published???

Postby Raphael » Thu Aug 19, 2010 1:09 pm

Raphael - I did read the responses in this tread and do not find my questions answered. Yes - I know the letters were destroyed or buried with him- I wonder if it is know exactly why - perhaps in some conversation or letter to Brown or Severn? I did not state that I think Fanny Browne was flippant - rather that some have portrayed her as such.



I have gone through it for you- here you are:



laraffinee wrote:I wonder why Keats requested that Fanny Brawne's letters be destroyed upon his death. Why? Did his circle of friends encourage it?


Answers from this thread:


I've read that Keats burned most of the letters that were written to him. It was either his habit to do so, or he decided at the end of his life (before he went to Italy) to burn them as a kind of symbolic "good-bye" to his friends. I'm guessing that, for the most part, he just wasn't the type to keep others' letters.

It's true that Fanny B's last few letters--those she sent to Italy--were burried with Keats as were the letters sent to him in Italy by his sister Fanny.

I'd LOVE to be able to read Fanny Brawne's letters to Keats written during their courtship. It's hard to get a real "handle" on their relationship when it is so one-sided (i.e. we only get Keats's often distorted perspective on things). Really, we don't even have a complete picture on Keats's side, as several of his letters to Fanny Brawne were destroyed by his friends/early biographers after his death because they were considered too "low class", cruel and painfully passionate. They didn't at all reflect the image that they wanted to create of Keats as being a heroic, sensitive poet.



I would add that: if you read John’s letters to Mr Brown then you will see he was too heartbroken to read letters from his beloved once he got to Italy, knowing he would die, so they were buried with him.

Why wasn't Fanny notified of his death before others were, such as Charles Brown, and as someone mentioned in another post, possibly Isabella Jones?


The news of his passing reached Britain in early February 1821- Fanny was told right away- there is no mention of Mrs Jones being told before Fanny Brawne.I don't know where you got that from.


Well, you did ask:

Some biographers describe Fanny as being quite flippant. How flippant could a woman be who loved John Keats, betrothed herself to him, despite his lack of funds (a very big deal in that day), and mourned him in what seems to be a very sincerely grievious way? Did his literary circle have an agenda about creating/maintaining a persona around John Keats? Did his circle of friends dismiss her value and meaning to him because they could not see it.?


Some people liked her some didn’t- just as you would get in any circle of friends today. To get to know her I suggest you read her letters to Miss Keats. Biographers have opinions and agendas like anyone else- I would read all his letters (to Fanny and his friends and family) and then her letters to Miss Keats- they are the real thing and tell more than other peoples’ opinions. I can only give you my opnions on the Keats Circle based on what I've read of the letters- the letters you will find are ther best source.Have a look through the life and letters threads as there have been many things discussed about them.

Also, you might like to post on the introduction thread to introduce yourself to everyone. Are you a student looking for essay answers? We have a homework thread if you would like help with anything.
John....you did not live to see-
who we are because of what you left,
what it is we are in what we make of you.

Peter Sanson, 1995.
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Re: Were the letters TO Keats ever published???

Postby laraffinee » Sat Aug 21, 2010 3:54 pm

Thank you Raphael. I will look for Keats' letters to Brown from Italy to look for his thoughts about letters from Fanny.
As far as information in this thread - well,

" I'm guessing that, for the most part, he just wasn't the type to keep others' letters."

That does not satisfy me, so, I need to go to Keats' and Fanny's letters to read what they were thinking and feeling.

There was a post about Isabella Jones in the Forum that stated she was told of John's death shortly after. I will search for it later but it is in the Forum.

Thank you for your information about help for students. I am a doctor for many years now, but my first course of study was a degree in English Literature, and my love a great writing has never left me. I love Keats' expression of his thoughts and feelings and his wonderful artistry with the English language.
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Re: Were the letters TO Keats ever published???

Postby Raphael » Sat Aug 21, 2010 4:14 pm

Thank you Raphael. I will look for Keats' letters to Brown from Italy to look for his thoughts about letters from Fanny.
As far as information in this thread - well,

" I'm guessing that, for the most part, he just wasn't the type to keep others' letters."

That does not satisfy me, so, I need to go to Keats' and Fanny's letters to read what they were thinking and feeling.


Yes- you will find all the letters really interesting to read and from erading their own words you get a sense of who they were and how they felt and so on. John knew when he went to Italy he wouldn't be coming back - he knew he was dying so maybe he burnt the letters as he felt he no longer needed them and with it being private correspondance to him it makes sense to dispose of them.



There was a post about Isabella Jones in the Forum that stated she was told of John's death shortly after. I will search for it later but it is in the Forum.



I don't know- not seen it- but never seen that in any of the letters or biographies. I don't know who would tell her or why as he stopped meeting with her once he was dating Fanny. I don't think she was even a close friend of his.



Thank you for your information about help for students. I am a doctor for many years now, but my first course of study was a degree in English Literature, and my love a great writing has never left me. I love Keats' expression of his thoughts and feelings and his wonderful artistry with the English language


Yes- he was an artist of words indeed! What country do you live in? I'm in England.
John....you did not live to see-
who we are because of what you left,
what it is we are in what we make of you.

Peter Sanson, 1995.
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Re: Were the letters TO Keats ever published???

Postby laraffinee » Sat Aug 21, 2010 4:55 pm

Here is the quote about Isabella Jones. It was in the "Did Keats die a virgin" thread.:

quote="keatsclose"]I wonder about Isabella Jones, whom he apparently met and had a brief relationship with on a visit to the seaside hamlet of Bo Peep, near Hastings.

It is Andrew Motion who (I think) tellls us that she was among the first people to be informed of his death, and it was she who told him of the superstition
about seeing one's true love on St Agnes' Eve that inspired the famous poem. Mrs Jones is a mysterious figure, and it would be interesting to know more
about her. Clearly a woman of the world and portrayed by biographers as something of a flirt, it may have been she who provided his sexual awakening.
Keats certainly seems to have valued her friendship as he remained in contact with her after their seaside encounter.[/quote]

The Motion biography is out of print and it does not appear, to me, to be worth chasing down.

I will post in the "introduce yourself" section soon. I live in the USA.

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Re: Were the letters TO Keats ever published???

Postby Raphael » Sat Aug 21, 2010 11:24 pm

Here is the quote about Isabella Jones. It was in the "Did Keats die a virgin" thread.:

quote="keatsclose"]I wonder about Isabella Jones, whom he apparently met and had a brief relationship with on a visit to the seaside hamlet of Bo Peep, near Hastings.

It is Andrew Motion who (I think) tellls us that she was among the first people to be informed of his death, and it was she who told him of the superstition
about seeing one's true love on St Agnes' Eve that inspired the famous poem. Mrs Jones is a mysterious figure, and it would be interesting to know more
about her. Clearly a woman of the world and portrayed by biographers as something of a flirt, it may have been she who provided his sexual awakening.
Keats certainly seems to have valued her friendship as he remained in contact with her after their seaside encounter
The Motion biography is out of print and it does not appear, to me, to be worth chasing down.



I borrowed it from the library and didn't find it that good- he makes a lot of suppositions without facts. I'd like to know his source of who told Ms Jones about John's passing and when it was. Some people think it was Ms Jones he was referring to when he wrote to Fanny Brawne that he liked the fact she liked him for his own sake and that he had met with women who wanted to married to a poem and given away by a novel. He had stopped seeing Ms Jones by the time he and Fanny had an "understanding" and were deeply in love. He also wrote to his brother that Ms Jones was just a friend and one he liked to talk with on art, literature etc. She wasn't a big part of his life like Reynolds, Brown, Severn, Haslam, the Dilkes and of course Fanny and her family were. She was only a passing friend/acquaintance.
John....you did not live to see-
who we are because of what you left,
what it is we are in what we make of you.

Peter Sanson, 1995.
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Raphael
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Joined: Mon Oct 19, 2009 6:10 pm
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