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Please, I could really use your help.Every little bit counts

Postby xo_mindy » Mon Apr 17, 2006 4:47 am

Hi. I'm in highschool and im in English 2 Honors. We're studying poetry right now and we have this huge project due. I was wondering if ANYONE could help me.
It would be very much appreciated.
I would source you in my bibliography too.

Okay.
I need some examples of
typical form in John Keats poetry.
Like..length, shape, meter, rhyme, and the common point of view or speaker.

One more thing.
Sound devices?
Alliteration
Assonance
Consonance


Ive been doing search engines day and night and I've been analyzing his poems like crazy.

I really do love his poem "To Autumn" though. Very beautiful.

If you could also..I need an example of a simile and a paradox. Because I am really confused on what a paradox is.

And if you want to put your opinion in. I need some critical claims about the poet. Again, you will be cited.

Thank you.
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Postby Despondence » Mon Apr 17, 2006 7:26 am

When is your project due?
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Postby dks » Mon Apr 17, 2006 4:28 pm

Yes, when is it due?

I (and/or anyone on here) can help you...but I know I would need another evening to put together a synopsis of Keats's work in relation to his chosen form, structure and subject matter(s)/themes...also the 'paradox' you are inquiring about--it is one of the chief underlying thematic components of his work, through "light and shade" and "death and love." I'd need another day or so to really pound out a solid exegesis of his key works. Can you wait that long? Or is your project due any day now?

Oh, and we'd all love to opine about him--we all have MUCH to say. You've come to right place--we're Keats fanatics!
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Postby xo_mindy » Mon Apr 17, 2006 7:02 pm

It's not due till about two weeks from now.

You guys are so awesome.
Thank you so much.

And for paradox I would need an example from his poetry.
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Postby dks » Mon Apr 17, 2006 8:16 pm

xo_mindy wrote:It's not due till about two weeks from now.

You guys are so awesome.
Thank you so much.

And for paradox I would need an example from his poetry.


two weeks? No problem. Between all of us, we can help you in plenty of time. :wink:
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Postby Malia » Mon Apr 17, 2006 8:46 pm

xo_mindy,
You said that you don't understand exactly what a paradox is. Understanding paradox might be the first step toward being able to find it in Keats's work. Below is a link to a whole list of paradoxical quotes (examples of paradox) so you can better understand what in heck a paradox is! :)
Hope it helps.

http://www.basicincome.com/bp/egsofparadox.htm
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Postby xo_mindy » Mon Apr 24, 2006 1:06 am

Alright guys & gals.
My english project is due this week.

I'm wondering if this is a paradox?

From his poem "Ode to Melancholy"

Line 5...
Make not your rosary of yew-berries,

Is that a paradox? Because yew means like a posioness berry...I'm not sure.

Can you guys help me out?

Thanks so much.
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Postby Credo Buffa » Mon Apr 24, 2006 3:20 am

Well, you could see that as a paradox, if a rosary is supposed to be something holy and life-affirming. However, if you look at it in context of the stanza, I don't necessarily think that's what Keats is meaning by the rosary here, but is rather using it as a symbol of something darker and more depressive (remember, this is a poem about melancholy!).

I wonder if you have to find examples of paradox on a line-by-line level. If you look again at "Ode on Melancholy", I think you might find that there is a very evocative thematic paradox at work here over the entire poem. To help you along, break each stanza down: what is the general theme of the first stanza, and how does he respond to that in the second stanza? Another way to look at it would be this: Keats tells you not to do something in the first stanza, so what does he tell you to do instead in the second? That's where your big paradox lies :)
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Postby Malia » Mon Apr 24, 2006 6:55 am

I agree with where Credo's going. A great paradox can be found in Keats's poem, "To Autumn"--where he utilizes the paradox of life and death. Death is necessary in making life completely fulfilled. What I mean is, in order for Autumn to achieve its ripeness and full beauty, it must be moving to and through decay.

The line "And fill all fruit with ripeness to the core" is a specific example of how Keats works this paradox. He's praising the fact that the season of Autumn is a season of fulfillment--of ripened fruit. But in that very line, he shows us that the fruit can only decay from there. It is ripe "to the core". In fact, in ripening, the fruit is moving toward decay--but it can't achieve its ultimate ripeness and beauty without decay. I'm not sure if I make sense--I'm writing this late in the evening :)--but I can explain further if you need me to.

In many of his poems, Keats's theme tends to be paradoxical. He focuses a lot on the pardox of love and death and the way they are inextricably linked when, on the surface, you'd think love and death are opposites. (The same can be said with life and death as evoked in To Autumn.)

Is your teacher asking you to find a line of Keats's that utilizes paradox--or can you focus on a paradoxical theme used in a poem (not necessarily an actual line or phrase but rather a paradoxical idea he's trying to get across)?
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Postby dks » Mon Apr 24, 2006 7:09 am

Malia and Credo--as usual--right on the money--

All of his odes employ great examples of the "Keatsian" paradox.

It is Keats's own brand of "Romantic irony"--Stuart Sperry talks about this in great length in "Keats the Poet"--you may be able to check it out at a local library? It's great criticism and it deals directly with Keats's work and his chief poetic elements in conjunction with his philosophies--ie.) "light and shade"
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Postby xo_mindy » Tue Apr 25, 2006 2:23 am

Yeah. I do have Keats the Poet by Stuart M. Sperry. I haven't read it yet. Maybe I should get on that.

Ok. Thanks for all you're help you guys.
You guys really are amazing.
You know that?

Okay. Well. Could you help me on shape? I know he writes a lot of odes..and sonnets (?)?
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Postby xo_mindy » Tue Apr 25, 2006 2:40 am

Oh.
& one more thing.
Does anyone know how many sonnets and odes that John Keats wrote? I'm getting numbers for sonnets, 17, and for odes, I'm getting 7.

Does anyone else have any idea?
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Postby dks » Tue Apr 25, 2006 3:50 am

Ok...he wrote 6 great odes...that is the 6 he penned from April 1819-Sept 1819...as far as sonnets go...does your teacher want you to knw his most famous ones? Or all the sonnets he wrote?

Also, in Stuart Sperry's book--check in particular chapters 1,2,10--those deal specifically with his poetic process and development, and his definitions of "sensation" as explained with regard to his perceptions and imaginative realm. You'll need to do some reading! It's pretty readable and very informative, though.

All the other chapters deal with specific poems--famous ones, including the odes. :wink:
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Postby xo_mindy » Tue Apr 25, 2006 11:37 pm

Yes. But in "To Autumn" I looked at it more as a metaphor than a paradox.

I understand what you mean though. But I used it as a metaphor against life and death (spring being life and fall/winter death).

I need to find some more examples of metaphors. I was told that I can find metaphors and similes in "Ode on a Grecian Urn", and "Eve of St. Agnes".

Thanks! :D
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Postby dks » Wed Apr 26, 2006 2:48 pm

xo_mindy wrote:Yes. But in "To Autumn" I looked at it more as a metaphor than a paradox.

I understand what you mean though. But I used it as a metaphor against life and death (spring being life and fall/winter death).

I need to find some more examples of metaphors. I was told that I can find metaphors and similes in "Ode on a Grecian Urn", and "Eve of St. Agnes".

Thanks! :D


There are excellent examples of metaphor in all the odes--and in "Eve of St. Agnes." Along with a host of other literary devices...do you have enough to time to get your hands on "The Odes of John Keats" by Helen Vendler?
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